Saint, Sorcerer, or Symbol? The Hidden Mysticism of St. Patrick

0:00 Coming up on Paratruth Reborn. We're talking about the men in history behind Saint Patrick. Welcome, Welcome, well do Paratruth Truth.

0:41 What's up everybody, and welcome to Paratruth Reborn. Saint Patty's Day Special in particular, we're doing a little early here, one week early because we do have a guest next week. My name is Eric, and I'm Justin, and many of us celebrate Saint Patrick's Day around the world by going out to bars to have green beer and have corn beef then cabbage and all the wonderful fictions that come with celebrating Saint Patti's Day, whether you're into the big parties or if you're like Justin and I, you just got a chilling at home with the were you know, to each their own. But nonetheless, this has always been one of our favorite time of the year, and I think in part because it kind of ushers in spring, which means warm weathers around the corner and all the green is coming back.

1:31 Well, and you know, with I don't know about everywhere, but in Ohio and in North Dakota the weather's been super weird, teasing us a little bit, and then it's hit with snow, tease a little bit and hit with snow, So this will be absolutely amazing if we're really that close to spring. But there's so much more to Saint Patrick's and Saint Patrick's state, you know, lore and myth and even history, so it's it's a lot more than what we're celebrating it for. Yeah, one hundred. But I think to really kick off this episode, it's probably best to really get into who exactly the real Saint Patrick is because there is a lot of myths surrounding his story, and in fact, there are some people, believe it or not, who claim he never even existed in the first place, that he's just a fictional character, which is kind of wild consistent considering that there is historical documentation. So with that said, most people think Saint Patrick himself was actually Irish, But is that true?

2:43 Justin well, to go back to the whole saints thing real quick, I mean, there's the part of that is like there's so many saints, like Saint Valentine where there's a couple of different or even Saint Nicholas, where there's a couple of different guys that could have in it. But this was the only scene Patrick, of course, and there, like Eric said, there's documentation. He was not Irish, believe it or not. He was Roman British born around late fourth century. As a teenager, he was kidnapped by Irish raiders and enslaved in Ireland for about six years, which is just mind blowing to me. And if you look at you know how kidnappings happened today. You know they even go for much longer sometimes, So that was amazing that he was able to escape that. But during his captivity he claimed to experience intense religious visions. After escaping, he later returned to Ireland not as a slave, but as a missionary from the.

3:44 Church, which is, you know, something that we kind of see over and over again within the Christian Church is these people who become enslaved and then you know, find their way to freedom and for some reason find a calling to go back to their original captors to preach the gospel itself. Now, there is some story that claimed that Patrick had had visions along with his teachings and his ministry. Is that true? According to his writings the Confessio, Yes, Patrick describes hearing the voice of God and dreams, experiencing guidance through visions. He believed divine messages instructed him to return to Ireland, which I mean again, you know, with a lot of the different saints and even in the Bible, you know, God leads people to these different areas, but you know, as saints or as missionaries, it was to bring the Word to the Pagans basically, and that kind of puts him. The fact that he had.

4:54 These dreams and these callings here God's voice and would have these divine messages kind of puts some in this genre of mysticism as well, very similar to Mother Teresa, who also was considered a missicist, which you know when you dive into the definition, and I think a lot of people think, well, that doesn't make sense be a missicist, but you know this Christian person, you know, or who claimed to be a Christian person, Because they don't always. Go hand in hand. In modern descriptions of the two, a lot of people think misticism tends to be more new agy which it isn't. Actually, it's actually an ancient thing that accompanied a lot of God's people as well. But now one of the big stories when it comes to Saint Patrick was the story of how he drove all the snakes from Ireland.

5:48 Did Saint Patrick. Literally banish snakes from Ireland or is there a little a little more to. The story or something we're missing? Absolutely not. He It's this drives me nuts because it's one of those things that you hear this, this legend, but Ireland never had snakes after that, the First or the Last Ice Age snakes that are widely interpreted as symbolic from the story. Uh, most scholars believe they represented pagan religion or Druidic practices. Even so, when the legend says he drove out the snakes, it's not literal. It is meant to be a symbolism of displacing Celtic paganism basically.

6:40 I mean, and so you know, calling you know, in this case Celtic pagan snakes is is really just. Bashing Yeah, you know, and I mean the Church was kind of known for that back in the day, at least the legends and you know, the the symbolism behind these things. Yeah, you know, we we We've heard Christ or read Christ talk about snakes quite a few times throughout the New Testament, and he even talks to the Pharisees calling them a brute of vipers on multiple occasions. And these are people who you know, some could say, oh bottom dwellers, if you will. Or they slither on the ground and they eat dust on them, you know, because there's the thing on the belly, or they strike with fangs. You know, they're quick to just stick the venom in to somebody and let them rot.

7:30 Leans that out. Well, it kind of goes back to the Bible though, to the snake in the garden and how it was somebody who not necessarily Lucifer. It could have been just somebody leading the the Adam and Eve away from God. So it could symbolize that as well them being satanic in the sense. And yeah, it could be satanic, could be I mean, it could be so many different things, you know, And I know there's been a lot of covers even you know, in the Christian now within I'm sorry, within the Christian Church, but also in particular within Christian education. You know, I got a associate's degree in religion and one of the things that we talked about was who exactly the serpent was.

8:18 Because there's a number of different beliefs. Obviously, the most recognized belief is that it was indeed Satan, the angel of Heaven Lucifer, as he has mentioned in the Book of Isaiah, but also there is some suggestion that this was another angel or demonic like creature or entity form, just a straight up snake that had no spiritual connection whatsoever. There is historical evidence, archaeological records that proved that snakes did at one point have limbs and walked on feet. And so there's this story in the Old Testament right in the beginning of Genesis when after the serpent tricks adam an Ee into eating the fruit from the tree, uh, God basically curses him to slither on his belly takes away, and there's you know, there's a lot of controversy around that until we found this archological uh evidence, which is pretty crazy to think about. And yeah, it makes one.

9:27 Right, And I mean, so it basically was kind of like a lizard, like a uh I can't even think of though, there's some really long lizards, but yeah, basically a lizard, and it got cursed to not have those legs anymore. Yeah. Well, and then on top of that, there's obviously a lot of discussion is too if this was just a regular snake, a regular serpent who is crafty. He apparently spoke, and so there was this I belief that animals at one point did speak in the early days before the fall. Whether or not. Adam and Eve just understood it just because they were at a direct just not to send it, but created straight from the Lord's breath. So well, now, when it.

10:18 Comes to the Druids and Patrick driving them out, was there any real conflict with that or did take cod with peace? Yes, but not as bad as certain religion conflicts go early between Patrick and the Druids. Of course, some stories depict dramatic spiritual showdowns, curses, fire rituals, even contests of power, almost like a wizard battle. I guess you could say, not exactly, but that's what kind of visualization comes to me. But these stories read like less like peaceful conversation and more like a supernatural confrontation or a battle.

11:02 Which again we you know, we we see a lot de scripture, So what it it would make sense that there would be this kind of belief behind it, Like it's it's interesting that there that that when it comes to Saint Patrick, there literally is a legend, you know, it's like a story upon story that formed itself into something that is just so out there and very movie like, when in reality doesn't work that way. But you know, a, I don't know, there were times maybe maybe I don't know, you had to be dick. Well, and that's that's the interesting thing. Is like. More like a supernatural confrontation. But a lot of the stories that you hear about stuff like this were like it, I'm just generically saying this, you know, a magical confrontation.

11:54 You know, a lot of that stuff was dramatized, so this could absolutely have been the same thing. Well, and then on top of it, you know, it's like, I like to think of it this one. We don't we don't really know what happens in the spiritual world sure at any given time, and so when somebody using prayer or someone else is casting spells or whatever, like right on the surface, you know, it's like, oh, we just see people throwing hands back and forth, and it's like nothing's happening. But then if you were to go into the spiritual realm, maybe there's this whole light show happening for all we know, right, you know, and it is kind of what we see in the movies. At that case, we need carry pottery, right yet Baltimore and Harry Potter, who's blasting each other with bolts of electricity or magic and.

12:41 Sometimes just force of of of magical force that you can't even see. So well, now, another big element to the Saint Patrick's story, of course, and to Saint Patty's day is the shamrock and the symbolism behind the shamrock. So how does the shamrock play into the story of Saint Patrick? And did he actually invent the shamrock as a symbol for the Holy Trinity. So there is no historical proof of this, but the legend says he used the three leaf clover to explain Christianity or I'm sorry, the Christian Trinity fathers on Holy spirit Interestingly, the number three was already a sacred number in Celtic spirituality, triple goddesses, triple spirals, triads. So was Patrick adapting Christian Christian theology to fit Celtic belief stems or strategically blending traditions. No real history there is to say for sure, but it has happened in multiple cultures where Christianity blends a lot of the other beliefs to help bring Pagans to Christianity.

14:08 So right, and we do have some historical evidence that does support Saint Yeah, Saint Patrick combining the Christian cross with the Sun god of the Druige of Ireland and that's where you get the Celtic cross from, you know, the cross with the circle in the center of it. Yeah, so he did. There is evidence that he has used, uh, some of their original belief system and kind of meshed it with the Christian belief system to make at a patient easier for them to come to the Lord. Uh And like you said, you know, we do see that in our history a lot mm hmm.

14:48 Yeah. Well, now when it comes to back when it comes to converge, what the word converged converts? Yeah, but I was thinking of converting convert. Oh yeah, I'm thinking I'm like conversion conversion. That's not right. Eric's a little under the weather. So forgiven. When it could when it comes to converting Ireland, was it a peaceful conversion? How did uh and how did Patrick force conversion? Overall? Well, that's the interesting thing about this is compared to other areas of Europe, Ireland's conversion was relatively non violent.

15:36 I mean, we we've talked about how he had supernatural con confrontations with the Druids, but uh, there's little archaeological evidence of wispread destruction of pay Insights in Ireland, which is why we probably still have like the the I lost what it is, the Stone che and there's plenty of other sites that were never destroyed. So instead of many sacred sites were actually repurposed in other words, churches being put on them or you know what have you.

16:21 Now this suggests something fascinating. Christianity in Ireland may have merged with existing Celtic spirituality instead of completely erasing it altogether, which happened in other areas. Now, that blending is why Irish Christianity developed its own mystical flavor, as you mentioned the Celtic Cross. I do believe there's some magic involved with Irish Christianity, or at least not necessarily spells, but something along those lines. Well, now, when we talk about then like the idea of magical flavor, we got to start thinking a bit about the supernatural, and in this case, in particular, the supernatural claims behind Saint Patrick's story. Are there miracles first and foremost that had happened within Ireland during this time, and were those miracles directly attributed to Patrick himself.

17:32 Yeah, there were a lot of them. Legends claim that he himself raised people from the dead, turned enemies to stone, lit a sacred fire that defied a pagan king. Now you do hear this from other saints or religious figures, but not as many as that were in the Bible, So now historically verifiable, No, of course not, because it could have been you know, fabricated, and he he just made up these stories to tell the Irish pagans so that it made him look more powerful, but culturally powerful. Absolutely, it made Patrick become less of us of a historical figure and kind of more of an archetype, which is probably why a lot of people believe that he might not have existed at all.

18:32 And I would argue, like, I'm sure if these any of these are stories, that he didn't go out of his way to fabricate them himself, but instead of fabricated by the Druids who maybe witnessed something and either they didn't see it the way they thought they saw it, or I should say they saw it the way it didn't really happen that's really how legends are born, right, Like it's it's kind of like telephone. You tell a story and that story gets, you know, bigger and bigger when it comes to a legend, until it's a complete blatant lie. But like you said, there is no real historical factor and what exactly happened and what he was capable of doing. But we do know that there is some historical evidence about certain things throughout scripture that are defined as quote unquote miracles. So you know that alone kind of I find intriguing knowing that it is possible.

19:26 We know that the Saints based on historical evidence and I don't say historical evidences and oh according to the Christian Church, but these are historical documentations by the Romans that are written in ancient books that basically cross with the Christian texts as being variable being true, Jesus turning water into wine, raising the dead, you know things like that that you know typically if it wasn't true, womans would have gone to the way to write it down. Did I will say that it would be really nice to have power to turn enemies, just don't don't do it.

20:12 I mean, any powers would be fantastic in mind. I mean, I don't know how many times I fantasized about having a superpower. So yeah, oh for sure. So now was Patrick a saint, a strategist, or a spiritual warrior? Probably all three? You know. He was a you know, as we mentioned, former slave, a visionary mystic, a religious reformer. He brought a lot of reform to the church as well as to converting pagans. And a political operator in other words, a kind of sort of a politician in a sense back in those days. And whether you see him as divinely inspired or myth the mythologic, mythologized, wow hero, he reshaped an entire culture in Ireland.

21:17 Which you know, we see time and time again throughout history and not just ancient history, even a modern history. We see this, you know, in terms of being becoming a mythical person, you know, in his sense, which is really kind of wild because it goes to show that if you have enough people who support you and raise you up, they can create the status for you that quite frankly you don't deserve, agree because how many of us are medical, right all right? But nonetheless, you know, when you look at the text that we do have about Saint Patrick.

22:00 We do. No, or at least we have an idea that he must have been divinely inspired based on the success that he had in converting Ireland into the Christian faith, because that doesn't come easy in most cases. You know, people aren't typically just pushovers. Everyone wants to fight back with their own beliefs, in their own views, and so when you see somebody convert, there's a reason behind it. It's not because in most cases it's not because they're forced to do it, but it's because they see something or they hear something, or they learn something that's like straight up speaks to their core values, and the core being is like this seems right, you know right.

22:43 And with the history the is out there, I don't know if it shows that. I mean, he obviously went with a ship, but I don't know if he went with other missionaries or took it upon himself to go and reach out to these tribes himself without without any escort, but that would have been really dangerous. So if he did it that way, Saint Patrick was a very brave guy because Ireland back then was very much a not savage but it was very much a chaotic and uh I talked about you know, Irish raiders coming to kidnap him when he was younger too, So it was very much chaotic. I guess, I guess is the correct term, Mary.

23:38 It was not as civilized as it is today. Right. Well, I mean, we've we've learned a lot here about Saint Patrick, and you've really delved into his history based on what we know, whether it's through historical context or through what are potentially just stories fairy tales. But nonetheless we get this idea that this kind of rounded idea of who he was both the myth, the man, and the legend right, because he's he's a bit of all three. And obviously, historically speaking, it's true that he had one of the biggest impacts both for the Christian faith but also for a country in general. To convert virtually an entire country roughly by himself is pretty pretty big deed, especially for the time. Right. But now that we've covered a lot here on Saint Patrick, let's shift gears a little bit because there is this other character really involved in Saint Patti's day, and this is one of those characters that I think everybody kind of you know, I think well, I'm sure everybody knows and to some extent loves maybe in some cases apps we despises, depending on how you were raised and the movies you watched. But that is the story of the lepre Kaun, and then

25:09 particularly the mystery behind the Leprechaun. Now, of course I grew up on the leprechaun horror films, so naturally I don't always like leprecauns. They're creepy, creepy critters when you look into the movies. But there's more behind it. It goes much deeper, and it's much more ancient, and it does have an origin, right, So where did the idea of the leprechaun comes from? All? Lepracauns were in Old Irish folklore long before Saint Patrick came around. They're believed to be a type of fay or fairy spirit, specifically a solitary trickster who worked as a shoemaker for the fairy world. The word leprechaun likely comes from the Irish blue I think is, which roughly translates to small bodied spirit and tradition stories traditional stories there weren't They weren't cute or friendly, They were mischievous, secretive and sometimes dangerous. Hence where the horror movie came from.

26:22 It really really honed in on that, because from when we were younger at least, the leper Kahn was as a fun, friendly guy who was just trying to get back his lucky charms from kids. Right you see, And and that's how it all starts. And then you try to turn some something like this into a kid's avatar, and then next thing you know, you got kids went in the bed and being attacked by something that they didn't think was real. Those darn Disney movies, Man Disneys. What Now.

27:06 Here's a straight up question. Were Leprecrons considered supernatural beings? Oh yeah, I mean it says it right there in the description of the folklore. They were of the fair fairy. You know, in Coltic Celtic folklore, Leprecauns were part of the IOC, the supernatural fairy race believed in inhabiting Ireland's hills, forests and ancient sites. You know, people believed these beings were guarding hidden treasure, played tricks on humans lived in another realm parallel to ours. Excuse me, kind of like the gin from Islam. They are are very much a spiritual or supernatural being. So in many ways they functioned like intermentional tricksters in folklore.

28:12 So well, let's so, you know, and that makes a lot of sense, you know obviously that it would potentially be a supernatural being and even spiritual. But let's jump into modern times because we have a lot of these beings that we believe to be spiritual through ancient texts and ancient belief systems. But now people are starting to say, oh, interdimensional are we talking about extraterrestrials, you know, something beyond this world? And in this case, we're talking about something that potentially would come from outer space rather than an interdimensional being that exists around this earth. Like, is that a possibility or do you think that's more of a stress. That's just people who are not like, hey, you're an extra testureal, you're an extra testriale, you're an extra text or all extraterrestrials.

28:58 Right. Well, I think that's the problem the paranormal is falling into, is that we're trying to slam all of these beings into one bubble. You know, a lot of people are now saying that aliens are not from another planet, but interdimensional aliens, if you will, coming in through another reality. I don't believe that all extrastrials are that way. Same thing with a lot of these cryptids, you know they're all being slammed into well, they must be interdimensional. We haven't seen a physical body or found a you know, a dead body. And that's where I think you and I both probably start to get a little annoyed with the paranormal. Is that we want to try and put a definition on things. And you know, back then when all this folklore came about, and I'm not saying these things aren't, because I do believe a lot of them are, but we always wanted to come up with a reason for something happening back then, whether these creatures are real or not, we were trying to place something outside of ourselves on For example, speaking of the Leprechaun, things going missing, you know, stuff like that, and we can't find them again.

30:23 I do believe that spiritual beings can make that happen. You know, they'll take your things and put them somewhere else, and then years later later you find them. But as a culture, as a society, humans try to place blame on non physical beings. Why did this airplane crash? Why did that car stop working? As creublins? Right, that was one of the big things at one point. Oh, they call it an act of God, and that's not necessarily the case at all. Right, do you think, like, I know we've covered this so many times, but do you think that people are trying to keep everything in a single bubble because it's just easier to manage that way, you know, because you know, obviously within the paranormal world, within the supernatural world, there are so many branches that we could talk about, right, because we have various types of spirits, variou steps of entities and very you know, go over everything from you know, God himself and various angelic beings, demonic beings, subdemonic subspirits, you know, think et cetera, et cetera. You know, there's like this huge, huge, huge kind of pyramid of entities, and instead of trying to classify each and everyone, it's like, oh, well, let's just make them one big bubble and.

31:41 Boom, they're all the same. I think we're trying to simplify it. Yeah, And like I mentioned about ancient humans trying to blame on something, it's because they were trying to simplify something too. So yes, in a sense, we're trying to amplify it, and really I feel there's a way more complex answer than we realize. I think my favorite part about all this is like we sit here every week with all this speculation, and a lot of us do here on epr N when it comes to the paranormal, and it's fascinating because I think many times you don't think about this, but as we're talking about these things, we're having these kind of like back and forth. I come to this sudden realization that there is potentially, somewhere in an alternate reality, these entities sitting at a computer of their own type doing the exact same thing about humans, whether or not we even exist, whether we're in true dimensional, whether we're physical beings, you know.

32:43 And it's like. I think a lot of us want to think everything that's outside of this physical realm is higher than us. You know, they're they're smarter and wiser, they're they're stronger. We'll have any proof of that. It's very possible that we are one of the strongest beings. We just don't see it that way because we are limited based on our dimension. That we know, whereas there are other dimensions where maybe various sympities are much more limited than what we are. And they're speculating and they're thinking, oh, well we're and of course that's a shoss. It's just something that like popped in my mind, like there is that possibility. We're always going around the board trying to figure out what these things are, but it's very possible they're trying to do the same.

33:24 Thing, right well, and I mean how and it's all been jokes, of course, but how many people have made this little parody thing of aliens and they're like, oh, did you see the new episode of Earth? Yeah it's crazy man. So but you know, the one thing that a lot of our guests have even said to us is that, you know, humans, unlike a lot of these other entities, are co creators, co creators of our reality? Now, is that true in other realities? Like you already meant, it'd be interesting to find out, because maybe there aren't humans in some realities, right.

34:06 Well, yeah, you know, and it's like we talked about we have talked about uh good, I can't think of the word, but you know, we would would as an individual or as like a mass group, we can create an entity based on Yes, it's possible then that many of these creatures or enthivies that do exist, or at least some of them exist simply because we did create them, you know. And since we're here talking about Saint Patrick and you know him being a Christian band, of course, you know, if then we were in regardless of whether you're Christian faith or you just believe in a higher power, we all have that God's spark, and the God's spark beings that we are creators. And so if we all have the spirit of God within us, we have that God's park, then we, being creators, could potentially create these things by simple thought without even recognizing it, without even knowing it. And so how many times we tell these stories and then all of a sudden we're seeing these creatures you know, come about and people are seeing them around the world. It's like, why did no one see this prior why is it just now showing up?

35:18 You know? So I do find that very intriguing right well, and with you know a lot of speculation about cern them finding the God particle, them possibly creating the different things, or not creating but creating riffs in reality so that these things can come through too. There's been that whole speculation to. The Pandora's Box, the modern Or's box. Right, I missed that game that we played. We subscribe in good times too. I wonder if you could even play it anymore on uh xbox or anything. All right, so we did. We repitraed a little bit here.

35:59 But going back to leprecauns, why are lepercauns specifically tied to Saint Patrick's Day? Now here's the thing about that. This is actually a more modern connection Saint Patrick's Day. It began as a you know, Saint Patrick Day began as a religion or I'm sorry, religious feast day celebrating Ireland's patron saint. But when Irish immigrants came to America in the eighteen hundreds, the holidays slowly turned into a celebration of Irish identity and culture and tradition. At that point, Irish folklore symbols like leprechauns, shamrocks, pots of gold, sorry getting folded into the holiday itself. So, in other words, leprecauns represent Irish mythology, not Saint Patrick himself. It just got put into this cauldron just like kind of an example of what us is this as a cauldron of multiple cultures. And then, like you said earlier, telephone it kind of gets muddled.

37:08 And you know, the people that were here, the English people that were here before that are like, oh you don't. One of our my Irish friends said that, Yeah, leprechauns used to harass Saint Patrick all the time. Not necessarily true. I'm just making that up, but it represents how the game of telephone can really affect mythology and. Legend like and in general, lepricns are also highly associated with, at least in most modern times, with the wee leaf and four leaf clovers, because they're also associated with luck in general, which again probably goes back to this idea of of them hoarding or protecting gold pots of gold, if you will, or treasure, and how if they were to lose any part of that treasure, then they potentially lose their luck and therefore they get sloppy, and you know, they're not as whimsical or quick witted as they maybe once were prior.

38:20 Now. Of course, that delves into a whole list of things, including. Montimedia. When we're talking about obviously movies, but also into various books and fairy tales, poems, things like that that have kind of branched this idea of a leprechaun and what they actually are, who they are, and what they're capable of. And again we don't know the exact origin. We don't have a boom. This is the day of the lepertown is created or can vout and this is what the power was because a lot of these entities that we do talk about on the show, they start pretty small and then over the years they grow and grow and grow until they kind of become this powerful being in themselves.

39:02 Right went now. We're fairies and pagan beliefs actually still around it during Patrick's time, Like we know that pagan beliefs were to an extent, obviously that was the whole point if we're going to begin with. But did he have to kind of interact with fairies or his bleep of fairies? And do we know how he interacted with them? Yeah, and this is where things get interesting. Christianity arrived in Ireland. It didn't erase older beliefs overnight, like we mentioned, it actually didn't erase them at all. It converted them in or absorbed them into Christianity that's practiced there today.

39:48 When Christianity arrived in Ireland, it didn't it was more than just what it was in other parts of Europe. Many people still believed in you know, fairy folk, sacred hills, spirit realms, nature, spirits, all types of different spirits. Instead of eliminating those ideas, Irish culture often blended them with Christianity. That's why Irish spirituality has always had a mystical flavor, like I mentioned earlier, compared to other parts of the world. Yeah, and we see that with a number of different belief systems. You know, we look at New Orleans video and it's Haitian roots and how that is spliced with Christianity, or the modern Christian witch who gets into witchcraft, but yet holds on to some of those Christian beliefs in those Christian characters and those icons that they grew up with, especially within the Catholic Church. So this is something that is widespread and happens from one book faith to another over and over throughout history and throughout the world. So it definitely would make sense that people back then would still believe in the fairy, fog and the Sacred Hills and you know, things like that, and somehow use them to kind of like grow their belief within their new Christian faith and adopt it in And it's always I

41:19 find I always find it intriguing to see how it's done, because some of it is just just really fascinating. Yeah, I mean, like every culture in general, when it especially ones that were converted from Paganism to Christianity, it always is fascinating to see what parts of that culture, the previous culture, I should say, were kept in the practices of Christianity. And we see that in the US of course, with Santa Claus and you know, the Christmas Tree and all that stuff. We talked about that during our Christmas episode. So yeah, it's it's interesting. And at the same time, there are those hardcore Christians with that will not practice any of that because it is a pagan connection.

42:15 Yeah, it's interesting to see how one adopts those things and another completely disregard to them, you know. And then again it comes all down to personal preference ultimately your own convictions and belief systems, et cetera, et cetera. So right, you know, you do have to wonder or at least I have to order. Like, as we move, you know, further into modern culture, we see a lot of our old belief systems, a lot of what used to be are current belief systems transforming. And like I said, you know the Christian which for example, that's that's pretty new and kind of way out there for old school Christian Christian Church. I mean, in many cases, I would think some of the founders are by rolling in their graves like well, what what, what's happening? But it makes you kind of wonder, like one hundred years from now, two hundred years from now, when there.

43:17 Are if a world even exists by then, when you have archaeologists in those times, you know, digging through America or through Europe or you know, where have you, and they start seeing this combination of belief systems so intricately interwhy intricately intertwined? What that kind of thought? It's right off the bat, and they look at it like it's this looks like a hot mess, just like a. Giant ball of Mumbo Dumbo. Or is it like, oh, this is very intricate and delicate and really fascinating of how these things worked together, you know, because could I think ass tam goes. You know, we're going to see more and more splicing of various blue systems and religions, and of course I think we will also see much more just completely disregarding faith altogether, regardless of the system that they people are following. We are now so yeah it would yeah so now really final question about the leprens. When it comes down to it, are leprechauns actually just a myth or they particularly something deeper?

44:39 This goes with everything we talk about. Researchers are are split across the board. Okay, you know, some reachers suggest that fairy folklore might reflect ancient beliefs about other early beings or spirits tied to sacred land. Others beliefs stories are cultural memory preserving old pagan traditions. Either way, Lepicauns are part of much a much larger mythological system that predates Saint Patrick by centuries. And that again can be said about a lot of things, and about how we have become afraid of these creatures that may not exist at all. We just saw something created an image in our mind, and then that became a lot of the like cryptids or even spiritual beings that we know now and like you mentioned earlier, possibly created them into our reality because so many people started fearing it.

45:48 Yeah, you know, and I think that's that's something that we need to consider tooms like there is this kind of fine line, semi fine line between fear and adoration or respect, because many of these cultures, you know, they have these entities and these beings that they genuinely respect, right they whether or not they look up to them, they at least lived with them alongside them. When we think about the leprechauns, we think about the faith, many people who just believe that you live alongside them are two different types of individual people groups, if you will.

46:31 But then there are others that do genuinely fear those same things, and a lot of that, of course comes down to misunderstanding, right because again, especially modern times, we have a lot of information at our disposal, and a lot of that information isn't good information. It's just throwing together by somebody who wants to create a story or wants to get a lie out there, because why not, right, And then we have a lot of individuals who are quickly gullible and they will find the you know, click that first link that pops up in the Google search. Read it, take it for fact, shut it down, and boom. They are set in their belief system and then their understanding.

47:13 But that's why it's important to constantly do research as well, because many of those things that do pop up first isn't typically the full story on Google, right, you got to do a deep dive. You got to and AI can only do so much. AI two can be tricked. It will often tell you information that is most widely accepted or mass produced, rather than getting down to the absolute truth the ground level or the foundation of some of these stories. And that goes as far back as like even were wolves, the dog Man, vampires. You know what, our very first episode on UPRN was about the vampire, and you know, we delved into it's orches story, how it began as just a spiritual entity that was just a ghost. Basically, it didn't do anything, it didn't harm anybody, but it grew over the years, over the centuries, and as it grew, it took on newer tributes until we got pretty much that we have of vampires today, which is in most cases very dark entity or being that goes out of its way to drink blood to kill the harm to live life the way that it knows at the height of food chain, right, But that's not how it began, and so then you have to question that, Well, if if the vampire started as just a ghost, then

48:47 the vampires that we have today do they even really exist? Right, Like, how did that happen? Well, I mean, and it's total affection, But you brought me a book, a vampire hunting book back way back when we were doing night Stalkers, and it talks about that vampires were the original vampire. They was possessed by a demon that or in this case, of spiritual entity. So if there are vampires today that do suck blood, and I mean we've talked about the energetic or spiritual vampires, maybe it's a possession case, kind of like a symbiotic relationship.

49:38 Right In that book that you're talking about, if anyone's interested, is actually called vampire. The Terrifying Lost Journal of Doctor Cornelius Vanels. Really fascinating. It's a lot of fun to read, and it's it's really interesting because it was like the first time I'd heard about or learned about this idea, which which is modern now it's like very well accepted in television and in books, but the idea that vampires, well, the big course like how do how does the vampire use things by into victim but yet draw blood at the same time, because if the fangs are plugging up the holes that the blood comes from, and we can't really drink the blood.

50:19 And so in this book, which way way way back in our early early years of podcasting, this was two thousand and seven or so two thousand and eight, it was the first time I heard about this idea that the fans have tiny holes that yeah, the tooth is hollowed out and draws back into the back of the throat where it can then be. Ingested or drink. Which again, if you guys have not heard about you guys haven't listened to our episode, I can to find out what they actual maybe you know the name of it. We do have an episode about vampires and the reality of them drinking blood, and we go into a very scientific aspect of whether or not a creature like a vampire can actually drink blood and survive hundreds of years basically, and it's it's one of my favorite episodes we've ever done.

51:12 It does use science to take a scientific approach. We talk about vampire bats, how they drink blood according to their weight, and how that transfers to what a modern vampire would need to survive as well, and whether or not it actually could survive while still remaining hit him all these years. Are you talking about the one that we first did on like you just mentioned on upr N, I. Don't it might have been. I don't know whether it's that one or not. It might have been. Yeah, I'm not sure if that was the one or not. That's good in a while to look for it. Yeah, but yeah, and you know there's been so there's been quite a few people on TikTok and I already hear you guys. It's not that I believe it, but I would love to get them on and have them tell their story if they are claiming their vampires, you know, I would love to hear what they have to say. Or Hey, if you're a vampire, email us. I'm not going to say reach out because I don't want you in my house. Email us at Paratrude Radio, which email account we'd love to bring on for to tell.

52:31 Your story, just because just to put out the just for for feelers. Specifically, we're talking about vampires that actually drew blood. Right right and claim to have lived for a very long time, not the human ones that put the things in their mouths and drink people's blood at a blood letting bar. Though, I would love to talk to you too and find why you feel that this is a good way to go about it. To So, when it comes down to Saint Patrick, Saint Patti's day, in particular the Leprechaun, what are some of your thoughts on the whole origin story here, some of these characters and just the overall story, the overarching story of these characters and what we celebrate today.

53:21 Well, I mean, Saint Patrick, without a doubt, is obviously a historical figure. I mean, we've already talked about these there's documentation to say that he was a real person. Did he have these these spiritual battles with withdruids? In his mind it was a spiritual battle, and in a sense was a spiritual battle because he was trying to convert these pagans to Christianity. Leprechauns. I mean, I've always kind of believed that Ferrier Fayre are real, All spiritual beings really something I kind of looked up as we were discussing stuff. Is where you know, the green beer and corn beef and cabbage came from. And I should have known better. But obviously this is an American thing that came about to kind of Greek Irish immigrants into celebrating Saint Patty's Day the way that we do today.

54:36 It actually didn't come about till the nineteenth and twentieth century because corn beef was actually a cheaper accessible substitute for traditional Irish bacon, which apparently is what they would eat in celebration of Saint Patrick. And the green beer came about from man named Thomas A. Which Curtain, who was a New York club owner in nineteen fourteen and added green food dye to beer, and it was again just a way to celebrate in the US, you know, the Irish American adaptation of Saint Patty's Day. I had never looked that up before. It was just a thing you did, so I never really looked into the history of it all. But yeah, it's one of those things, as far as tradition goes, that sometimes gets lost. I'm not talking about the corn beef and cabbage. I'm talking about how we celebrate Saint Patrick's day today. But it's fascinating to look at the history and the folklore and the legends behind it all.

55:57 One hundred percent, I completely agree with you, And I didn't know anything about the green bearder all that. You know, what year was that that if it? They did the Green die nineteen fourteen, nineteen fourteen, and I think they still do go today, right. And so in retrospect to history as a whole, that practice is very much in its infancy compared to many other practices that we have to right. Well, you know, as if has really most anything, not everything, but most everything in America for whatever reason, it all has to be done bigger. And boulder for some reasons. So I mean, you know, I don't I don't know.

56:38 I don't have words to wear it. It's it's insane, that's the word. We'll go away, it's insane, anise, psychiatry, that's. Uh. But no, I agree with you. You know, it is a literal fact that Patrick, Saint Patrick did exist. He was an actual. Person who literally did convert Ireland to the Christian faith and drove out some of the pagan teachings and the druids because of it. And again, whether or not that meant entirely, you know, pushing them out or simply pushing out the bleach system that they held, is up in the air. But at this point it doesn't really matter, because the simple fact is what he did. You know, it made history, and it took and it stuck, and as in most cases, it does or has when it comes to the Christian faith, right and you know, I do find it off fascinating, and of course the Leprechaun is one of the most fascinating creatures icon him creatures, but you know, entities that we've come across, and we don't talk about it enough.

57:52 Obviously. This is something that we always keep for March, really because we have no other reason to bring up the Leprechaun outside of March here in America. And then finding a historian or philosopher or somebody who's written a book about it is kind of rare too, oh yeah, one hundred percent. But nonetheless, you know, this is one of our favorite, one of our favorite holidays. And we're not partygoers anymore, you know, we just like the idea of it. And we here in the US like to dress in green drink things that are green, eat things that are actually not green in most cases, unless the cupcakes.

58:32 I mean cabbage is before you cook it. That's fair use that everything green. So and you know the funny part is most people that go out party and they eventually turn green too, So it's funny how it all comes around. Anyway, this is the end of today's episode. We do hope that you liked it, and if you loved it, please share it with all your friends and family. And also if you want to talk with us or won't you have any comments, feel free to reach out. We'd love to hear from you and we will respond, of course, we love responding. So so until next week, well you'll find us, same time, same channel.

59:12 My name is Eric and I'm justin peace.